Torrevieja Forum

[bladesboy1]

How can the estate Agents be so bad ? We went to purchase a property in Torrevieja, I got the money transferred ready for the reserve. I got the simply after making an offer that was excepted. I found then the property had 81.000 Euro in Debt with 13.5% interest That I would be responsible for so we declined. The second property had terrible wiring in the meter room that should be locked but was not with live buzz bars exposed with children playing in the area outside the room. There were meters by passed , cables cut . I emailed the electric company and got no reply. All the Agents want is your 3000 Euro Reserve. How can it be possible to sell places like this. Spanish Law says if there is debt on the property the new owner takes it on. They should not be allowed to sell these type of properties. Got back last night after 5 weeks and I am stressed out

[freddo]

All Estate Agents are not bad you picked the wrong ones unfortunately
I would never have taken those properties on my books

[Info]

Disappointing that it wasn't a good experience, but would an estate agent know that a property had a debt registered against it. Would that not be the job of the solicitor as part of due diligence? Did you just use the one estate agent? Do you know what area you want to buy in? Maybe freddo has something that might suit. Have a look on www.Idealista.com and see if there is anything in your preferred area.

Bee

[bladesboy1]

I Think so many Estate agents are con men. I lived and worked in Spain before with estate Agents so I know the System. We went with several Agents. Some of the properties were too good to be true. Our Spanish friends in Torrevieja were a good help. They warned us of problems after seeing the photos and the simply copy that showed the debt. The debt was double what the house was worth with another 13.5 % interest .

[retire1day]

I have friends who have handed over a reserve only to find out the proposed build had no planning permission, never got their reserve back. Plenty of cowboys in Spain. Worse one is if you sign over power of attorney, estate agent pockets €20k and puts property through the books at lower rates. When you sell the place there is capital gains tax if not your main residence.

[freddo]

did your friends claim their deposit back through official means and did they denounce the agent as if the property was described as legal the contract was broken by the seller so deposit should have been refunded doubled, also surely the contract must have stated the selling price of the property and nobody in their mind would give a POA to anyone that was not a legal person

[bladesboy1]

I have purchased 2 properties in Spain 20 years ago and never had a problem but it seems the system has changed. I do not think these agents should be allowed to sell property with debt. I have really been put off.

[Jacarilla_h]

Not all agents should be tarred with the same brush. Some use good lawyers who pick on debts and make retentions from the seller. Good luck with your search. Jacarilla, near Orihuela City is a nice village with a good estate agency

[Info]

How is the person that is owed the debt going to get their money back if the property is not sold? Was the property being sold by a bank? Would it be that the debt would be cancelled by whoever is due the debt once an offer was made? Not knowing the full story it is a bit vague. The taxman will be looking for his share if the property is sold below market value so there is no point in advertising it at a giveaway price.

Bee

[freddo]

The property will be sold and the title and debt will be registered to the purchaser. It will be up to the person or company who is owed the debt to recover it.
The debt will show up on the final search that the Notary does before he completes the paperwork .

[Wendy]

Doesnt this make these properties unsalable who in their right mind would buy a house at the market price and pay off someone elses debt? seems the companies are shooting them selves in the foot, surely the debt should be taken from the vendor on sale, or am I not understanding this?

[longjohn]

The debt stays with the property, the same as with buying a car any fines debts embargos stay with it.

[freddo]

That is not true you need to see a legal professional to see which debts will remain as utility debts do not remain with the new owner according to law

https://www.citizensadvice.org.es/faqs/debt/

[Info]

Thanks Fred that is a very helpful link. It all goes back to due diligence on the part of your Abogado when doing the searches on the property and knowing the questions to ask. Who would know to ask these questions in the first place unless they were aware of how Spanish law works regarding registering debt on a property. I would think 99% of us are lucky our property purchase turned out ok without knowing what could have gone wrong. For the one percent for whom it didn't go right it's a nightmare. We all know the long-running nightmare of a post from Fly380 on this Board.
So to recap always employ an independent Solicitor/Abogado to do the conveyancing of the property into your name. The questions you need your Abogado to give you the answers to:

Has the property Planning Permission for its original build and any add-ons. Has it its Habitacion Cert. Are there any debts registered against the property. is the IBI paid and up-to-date. Are Community Fees paid and up-to-date and has the Community agreed any charges which have been deferred for payment to a future date. Has the vendor paid over the Plus Valia tax to the Town Hall. Lastly on the day of signing has the property register been checked for any debts were registered against the property within the last 24hrs.

All monies for the purchase of your property should be lodged in your Solicitor's Client Account. Make sure it's a client account as if you happen on a crooked solicitor your money is covered by an indemnity from the law society (I hope I am correct in saying this and that such a thing exists in Spain). All monies should be by bank transfer so that there is a paper trail. Don't be tempted to pay any black monies in cash if asked as when you sell your property and there is a gain you will end up paying more tax.

Anything else imporant I have omitted?

Bee

[longjohn]

That is not true you need to see a legal professional to see which debts will remain as utility debts do not remain with the new owner according to law

https://www.citizensadvice.org.es/faqs/debt/

I bought a villa off-plan in 2006 and the solicitor I used was connected to the developer. (my mistake)

I ended up owning a villa with an embargo on it for €477000 because nobody checked. I had to engage a recommended solicitor to take up the case. After 2 years I won the case because I had paid 90% of the asking price before the debt was put on and the embargo was removed. Total legal cost to myself €2500. (unrecoverable).
I was advised by the 2nd solicitor to always ask for these checks to be made as a solicitor may not do it automatically.

Only give your money to your solicitor, not to anyone else ie (Estate Agent)
Ask if the property is legal.
Does the property have a certificate of habitation (if not it there is a chance it is not a legal building)
Check for embargos that may be in place.
Check that the actual buildings and outbuildings ie swimming pool, garage, are shown on the deed plan. (if not they may not be legal)

When I bought m 3rd property in Spain I did all these things and everything was revealed. So no nasty supprises this time