Torrevieja Forum

This Section Is Sponsored By Member " BRANDYBOY ".
This Section Is For Discussions About Politics Only.

Moderator: Moderator

By Aviator
#1112470
The whole Brexit process is like the a political thriller, full of plotting, unexpected alliances and lots of back-stabbing. At the moment, it appears that Theresa May's preferred Brexit agreement will be rejected by Parliament's "Meaningful Vote" so the question arises, what happens next?

This morning a new element entered the scene. The UK Supreme Court rejected an appeal by the UK government to block an application by a Scottish political/legal group to the ECJ for a ruling on whether, or not, Article 50 can be revoked/withdrawn unilaterally by the UK. Legal opinion, including that of Lord Kerr who drafted that part of the Lisbon Treaty, suggests that Article 50 is revocable because no EU member state can be forced to leave the European Union.

If the government cannot get the agreement of parliament to its preferred deal, one possible way forward from such an impasse would be for the government to withdraw Article 50 and hold a second EU referendum to see if UK voters still want it to proceed with Brexit on what would then be a 'No-Deal' basis.

Interesting times!
User avatar
By Sheff_Blade
#1112494
Interesting times indeed. Anything could happen over the next few months. I certainly wouldn't put any money on which way it will go.

At the moment I suspect we will remain. We will lose our rebate, in fact we will have to pay-in considerably more as the EU needs the money, and everyone will need to pay more. Possibly we will be forced to join the Euro, though I'd put this as an 'outside' possibility. We will become a second class member, the unruly one at the back of the class who had the temerity to ask for more. Not a good position to be in.
By rspltd
#1112735
The EU is so desperate that we stay that they have managed to get the EU Court of Justice to fast track (almost unheard of) an application as to whether Brexit is reversable and surprise, surprise, it is! They also say that they haven’t had enough time to complete the wording of some of the documents needed for Brexit!!. They are struggling to understand how the democratic process works in the UK as in their countries they would have just told the people that is what is going to happen. Interesting that Markel was quite happy to say here would be no change to the agreement - she obviously consulted the other 27 before she said this or perhaps they are just doing as they’re told.
By Aviator
#1112739
The Brexit deal negotiated by Theresa May may be 'clarified' by the EU but the sort of fundamental changes which the DUP and euro-sceptic wing of the Tory party want seem unlikely. For this reason its approval in a House of Commons (HoC) vote seems very unlikely. It also seems there is no majority in the HoC for a no-deal Brexit so what are the options, if as seems inevitable, Theresa May's preferred deal is voted down in January?

The only solution to the current brexit impasse that I can see is to revoke Article 50 and revert to the 'status quo' of EU membership until a new referendum can be held. Having rejected Mrs May's 'half-way house' brexit the two options on the referendum ballot paper should be to remain in the EU, or leave on a no-deal basis ASAP. Also, every MP should be required to sign a paper in advance of the referendum confirming that they will abide by its result, regardless of the whether they agree personally with the outcome.
By rspltd
#1112800
There will be no new referendum as those who are advocating want to use it as a last resort to stay in the EU. I suspect May will find out (as did Cameron) that the EU will pig headedly stick to it’s original negotiating stance until it is too late and the it will find out the boat has sailed and with €39 billion on board too!
By Bill Posters
#1113209
Like the general elections it’s a stitch-up. The parasites of Pigminster, regardless of political persuasion, their braying and the catcalls, are the best of buddies in the House bars. They have much to cheer them.

We are as innocent as infants watching a Punch and Judy show whilst backing one or the other. The guy who holds the puppets (media, banks and the lobbyists) manipulate the outcome.

It’s all just a circus to keep us distracted and under the illusion that we are running the country. They do the cock-ups and corruption ~ we take the blame. Perfect; people, whether they like it or not, are naïve sheep to the slaughter house.
#1113379
I caught something on Radio 4 this morning but can't remember the bloke's name.

His suggestion was that we go ahead with May's deal but with a proviso that there is a second referendum in four years time. The indefinite backstop would not be a problem, and the EU would have four years to make us an offer to attract the British people at the second referendum to re-join.

I'm not a big fan of a second referendum, I think it would be a disgrace to have one now, but in a few years time (four or five), then I could accept that.

It sounds a good idea to me, as it would seem to satisfy everyone.
By rspltd
#1113417
I think the people have had enough of paying out for vanity products in the EU with their hard earned money. Although the austerity in the UK has not been as severe as in other EU countries, we have had it and it’s time for the money to be spent on the UK. The EU economies are starting to fail and now Germany is starting to struggle, it is time to abandon the sinking ship. Even if the EU is given four years to come up with something they wouldn’t be able to as the two goals - single market and combined federalism, are poles apart.
User avatar
By Sheff_Blade
#1113421
rspltd wrote:
Wed Jan 23, 2019 9:34 am
I think the people have had enough of paying out for vanity products in the EU with their hard earned money. Although the austerity in the UK has not been as severe as in other EU countries, we have had it and it’s time for the money to be spent on the UK. The EU economies are starting to fail and now Germany is starting to struggle, it is time to abandon the sinking ship. Even if the EU is given four years to come up with something they wouldn’t be able to as the two goals - single market and combined federalism, are poles apart.
I wouldn't disagree with you but there is an impasse in parliament (rightly or wrongly), so there has to be a compromise or there's a very good chance we will be forced to remain. This option would remove the backstop and would give the public a second referendum, BUT we would already have left. The EU would therefore have to give us a good deal to tempt the British public to rejoin, and we would have survived for four or five years without the sky falling in, so project fear would not be a suitable argument for the europhiles.
By Kinchy
#1113432
Whilst I agree with you sheffblade, your comments are based upon the assumption that the EU will be as it is now.
With Germany and France having recently signed a pact in the border town of Aachen to further their plans for greater federalist expansion with a EU army and other alignments on tax etc, there may well be a different EUrinal to what we see today.
Also, after the EU elections in May, there may well be a greater presence of the so called populist factions from Italy and France's yellow vests, and especially the 5 Star of Italy and the RN of France. The Vizegrad of the East have been a pain in Drunkers backside and the voting populations in those nations especially Hungary may well lead to a very Eurosceptical EU Parliament.
Also the assumption that the UK may wish to rejoin could be based upon the UK's economy having crashed as the Project Fear doom mongers predict.
Based upon todays released figures for UK employment and especially unemployment being at it's lowest for 40 or so years, would the UK population agree to A The reintroduction of free movement B Accept the Euro as its' currency ( if of course it is still around) C Increased contributions to the bottomless spending pit without any rebates?
User avatar
By Sheff_Blade
#1113433
My comments are not based on any assumptions; the idea is simply a means of getting around the current brick wall. The remoaners won't be keen because we would already have left, but they would have to accept it because it gives them their referendum. It shoots down their arguments about not knowing what we voted for. The fact that we will have lost our rebate, and the EU would probably insist that we adopt the euro to rejoin all makes the likelihood of a rejoin win in four or five years more unlikely. It struck me as quite a good option to move forward.
By Kinchy
#1113447
My comments are not based on any assumptions;
My apologies for my comments and of course you are correct

the idea is simply a means of getting around the current brick wall. The remoaners won't be keen because we would already have left, but they would have to accept it because it gives them their referendum.
Will many of them in 4 - 5 years time even have the memory cells to recall their advocations that they now propose?

It shoots down their arguments about not knowing what we voted for.
Absobloodylutely. We knuckle dragging thickos never knew what we voted for - just ask freddo as he thinks that we are all half a brain short!

The fact that we will have lost our rebate, and the EU would probably insist that we adopt the euro to rejoin all makes the likelihood of a rejoin win in four or five years more unlikely. It struck me as quite a good option to move forward
Agree totally, but do you think that that the EUrinal will be around in it's present form in 5 years time? With the rise of the populist movements across Europe, I do not think so - do you?
This forum

Yes Peace and Love. Roses not brickbats 😊 Bee

Shamima Begum - the teenager who fled London to j[…]

All sorted now Thanks

Thank you all. We managed to get them at the tile[…]

What a great , interesting thread to read. Sorry F[…]

Getting new road tax

Deb64 it says on the SUMA site that depending on w[…]

Topic locked

The only `bizzare ' thing about this forum is th[…]

Capital Gains Tax Question

Thanks Bee Interesting reading!! Mark

New Advertising Slots and Possibilities